Sam Alaimo: 00:03

This is the Nobel podcast where we talk about how to optimize your technology, life, and bind. We're joined by special operations veterans, entrepreneurs, investors, and others who have overcome difficulty to make it to the top of their craft by staying in the fight.

Sam Alaimo: 00:24

What is your name?

Dustin Brooks: 00:26

Yeah. Name is Dustin.

Sam Alaimo: 00:28

Where'd you grow up?

Dustin Brooks: 00:30

I I grew up in a small town in East Tennessee. It's primarily a manufacturing town. It's a big church driven community too, so a lot of southern baptists. And it it's like all in the same mix. You got the Methodist across the street from the Baptist and the press materials across the street from there.

Dustin Brooks: 00:48

And I think it's still kind of that way. And then I think everybody was always jockeying for position for parking. So parking is a premium around the around the churches. It's brought it out. There's been you know, there's through manufacturing, there's a lot of foreign direct investment and management teams coming in in our area.

Dustin Brooks: 01:05

So there's a really unique blend of, like you know, there'd be, like, Korean kids at our school, and there there'd be German kids at our school. We had a foreign exchange student stay with us when I was a kid. He was going to high school, and my mom kinda got embedded with it and, know, got in the mix, and he actually stayed with us for a while. And then there was a, a teacher from Japan that we kind of, you know, adopted and brought into our family. I got a pretty good look at, like, the international broader landscape as a young kid without ever having left.

Dustin Brooks: 01:43

And and I didn't actually leave until, like, you know, 23 years later.

Sam Alaimo: 01:47

So we had Mike Way, our CEO on the podcast. He had a colorful childhood. And it's interesting when you look at some of the guys who become SEALs and then go into the business world, found companies, VC backed. You might not think that they'd have childhoods like that. Did you have yourself a pretty colorful childhood?

Dustin Brooks: 02:06

That was a mess. That was an absolute mess. Like and then the more that they tried to control it, the more rebellious they got. Right? Being a father now myself and I see kids and and knowing how I grew up, I see their need to be outside.

Dustin Brooks: 02:24

I see their need to run around. I see their need not to be, like, feral like, wild animals. Right? Like, we're not trying to find a place for our kids to, like, go chew on a deer in the backyard or something. But I I see the need for kids to, like, just be in nature, be outside, explore.

Dustin Brooks: 02:44

You know, that was something that that I personally needed. I needed engagement. I needed to I needed more than 30 minutes of recess a day. I needed kind of that Montessori environment from school. And it's, you know, stuff didn't exist.

Dustin Brooks: 02:59

Right? Pre k, elementary, middle school, high school, and it's all, you know, sit in a room, study, be quiet, raise your hand. And for me, I was a very active child, very active today in my current life. I need engagement, and I need to get that out. I need to do it before I can settle and focus.

Sam Alaimo: 03:22

Mhmm.

Dustin Brooks: 03:23

And growing up, we didn't really get that. So I got into a lot of trouble because I I I made my I made my own engagement.

Sam Alaimo: 03:31

Was the underwear model before or after you on on salt? No.

Dustin Brooks: 03:37

So so when I was a kid, I had probably, like, 8 to 10. I don't remember how old. My mom had gotten in touch with whatever. I don't I don't even know how. Maybe, like, through friends or something with a talent agency that was in Knoxville, Tennessee.

Dustin Brooks: 03:56

And, again, you know, Knoxville is not, like, even a midsize city. It's a small size city. But they had a teller agent there, and the lady that ran it was, I think, former Miss Tennessee. So she was, like, she was kinda in that mix. And then she took over the agent position and was just, you know, business lady through and through.

Dustin Brooks: 04:17

We got in contact with her when I was a kid and tried to work with her. So they they do all the different things. So from a talent agency, they they do voiceovers. They do acting. They do modeling.

Dustin Brooks: 04:30

They do all this stuff. And I did some stuff when I was a kid.

Sam Alaimo: 04:32

So, like How old were you talking?

Dustin Brooks: 04:34

I mean, like, like, 10. Wild. Because one thing I did was, like, a bike safety video for for schools.

Sam Alaimo: 04:40

I didn't even know any of this. This is great.

Dustin Brooks: 04:42

I liked it because I got to leave school and go do this stuff. Anyways, companies come in, and they go to these talent agents, and they say, we have these projects. Do you have talent? So, like, my thing was, you know, I could, like, ride a mountain bike really well. So they did this whole, like, bike safety course on me riding my bike.

Dustin Brooks: 05:02

Like, I'd be riding riding down the street. They would open up a door, and I would have to slam on my brakes and show them how to appropriately do this. So I did this stuff as a kid, and I got paid really well. I mean, like, to do the bike safety video, you know, it was, like, a few $1,000. And as a kid to do that stuff, that was pretty impactful.

Dustin Brooks: 05:19

I've never gravitated towards, like, you know, a 9 to 5 job. I worked construction for a while, did roofing and waterproofing and and all these different construction jobs. And it was just man, it was a kinda eye opener to what real work was like. It was more of like a summertime thing. It wasn't like a full time jobs and positions.

Dustin Brooks: 05:40

And I went to college. And when I would come back from college, my dad had since left the sales industry and was pretty entrepreneurial in his approach. He was trying to use kind of what he knew about the retail business and do something regionally within our our our region. Didn't really see what they were trying to do, so I didn't enjoy it. And I didn't want to get a job.

Dustin Brooks: 06:02

I was like, well, I did this stuff when I was a kid. Maybe I can go reengage with that lady and see what's available. And, you know, obviously, come back here. Not a kid anymore. I'm I was playing college football, 21, 22 years old.

Dustin Brooks: 06:17

Had put on some size, and and she was like, you should try modeling. And I was like, okay. Seems pretty socially awkward.

Sam Alaimo: 06:26

It's not 9 to 5.

Dustin Brooks: 06:27

Yeah. It's not 9 to 5. And and she told me that the the money that I can make doing it, you have to build a card. You you have to build, like, essentially your your CV or whatever. I didn't have any money.

Dustin Brooks: 06:39

She phoned me the money to go do the shoot, And I show up, and there's this guy there that he was he was previously in New York. He worked for her and they got picked up by a talent agent in New York. And he was making crazy money. Like he was he went full model, He was making all this money and he got into a this is the story. I was told he got into a terrible car accident and actually, I think, killed a family as he was driving too fast in in this car that he purchased with all this money that he was paying.

Dustin Brooks: 07:17

But he came back, and he was, like, trying to get back into the industry. I showed up, and this guy, nothing else of body fat on him. And he was he was, like, he was like a good looking dude, and I was like, dang. Maybe I maybe I should try acting. And he said, like, I was like, damn.

Dustin Brooks: 07:34

So I was like, the whole time I was doing this shoot, trying to build this card, I was super self conscious because, like, he had, like, the poses and the looks. And I'm I'm just like, yeah, I'd, like, flexed in the mirror a couple of times. I did that and then started kind of building some traction in the industry, paid really well, and I didn't have to get a job.

Sam Alaimo: 07:52

Not a bad gig. What did you actually wanna do when you were a kid compared to let's let's take that point from what you wanted to do to the first moment you realized you wanted to become a SEAL? How did that evolve?

Dustin Brooks: 08:03

I wanted to be a marine biologist. I actually did an internship out of high school. Education didn't come naturally to me. And those types of educational pursuits, you know, you have to be on your game. I started those courses like, nope.

Dustin Brooks: 08:18

This isn't happening. I always had a draw to the water. I grew up competitively swimming. And I think that that kind of draw to the water When I made the decision to go to the military, it kinda helped me craft towards, you know, the position I did.

Sam Alaimo: 08:35

How old were you when you thought about the military?

Dustin Brooks: 08:38

Like, 6 months before I went in.

Sam Alaimo: 08:40

Oh my god. So early twenties.

Dustin Brooks: 08:42

I enjoy adventure. Like, I I I remember, you know, in high school, I would just try to make stuff up. Like, no money, no equipment, no resources, and we would swim out to islands and the lake and then, like, try to do survival week or whatever in the summer times. And I was always searching for that, and I lived in a pretty siloed community and, you know, didn't know how to exercise it in the way that I wanted to. So I always felt underserved in that position.

Dustin Brooks: 09:10

And then I remember when the idea of going to the military actually stuck with me and, like, came in as a viable option. I was like, that is the adventure that I was seeking. And so my jump into the military was, like, kinda twofold. Right? It's like what I discovered after I got in, which is completely different than what I thought it would be.

Dustin Brooks: 09:32

I was seeking an adventure, you know, and it I don't like, it could have been anything, but I wanted it to be bigger. Like, I wanted it to be something that had a little bit of weight to it. And going into the military was that.

Sam Alaimo: 09:45

Did you wanna do the military or become a SEAL? Like, was there a specific want in the military?

Dustin Brooks: 09:50

A SEAL. That was the adventure that I wanted. There was no other option. When I looked at the landscape, I was like forever, yeah, ADD driven kid. Like one day, I get to wake up and scuba dive.

Dustin Brooks: 10:04

The next day, I get to wake up and, like, shoot guys. The next day, I get to wake up and jump out of planes. I was like, that's phenomenal.

Sam Alaimo: 10:10

Did you go straight to budgie of the Steel Challenge contract?

Dustin Brooks: 10:13

Yeah. So when I was coming through, I think you guys were maybe the first class you're

Sam Alaimo: 10:20

In Chicago. Pre boats? Yeah. Yeah.

Dustin Brooks: 10:22

Yeah. So we were the one right after you guys. Prior to your class, people would come into the the Navy and they would have to pick up a rate and the special operator wasn't a rate. So they'd have to pick up a rate, They'd have to go to their a school. And a school is, you know, master of arms or corpsman or

Sam Alaimo: 10:43

Your specialty in the Navy.

Dustin Brooks: 10:44

Your specialty in the navy that would now be your job. And then you go to try to apply to go to BUDS, which is SEAL training. So when you came in 271, it was the first time that they were actually making the SR rating a thing. And then when I came in, you know, a year later, that process was still being refined. I came in with a contract.

Dustin Brooks: 11:11

I threw up on my first PST.

Sam Alaimo: 11:13

You put out. So you get the buzz. What what would you say your your the best moment of buzz was? What was a a moment of revelation or a moment that made you think it was all worth it, the the the best moment from buzz you could articulate?

Dustin Brooks: 11:25

Every day. I love training. It's because you wake up and it's like, hey. If I do this, this, and this, I will have a successful day. And and there's somebody that's there kinda guiding you through it.

Dustin Brooks: 11:40

So I loved sport, and I think sport was kinda driven the same way. So you show up to practice. You've got your individual drills that you do. And then, you know, you do those and then show your ability to excel at those, and then you have a successful day. So training was there was no ambiguity there.

Dustin Brooks: 12:01

It was if I show up to this thing and do what they tell me to do, like like Forrest Gump style, like, why did you do that so well? Because you told me to. I could be successful there. And something that weeds out that pipeline early on in the process is physical attributes. They've always been very physical.

Dustin Brooks: 12:20

So to me, that kid running around that was told to be quiet, like, that wasn't the environment. Right? That was I got to be in an environment where I got to do exactly what I should be doing, and that's been around with my buddies and being physical. And so I the whole time, I loved it. So I did really well.

Dustin Brooks: 12:44

That was second time every time and and pretty much everything. Didn't get a medical role. I was very fortunate to make it all the way through. The tread was the only thing that came up that I was like, this is gonna end me. And which sucks because we had guys in our class that, like, made bets with the instructors that didn't do it with fins.

Sam Alaimo: 13:04

And I can't even imagine. So he's second phase is the dive phase in buds, and the the selection isn't quite over there. You still have to pass some tests, and the tread is a purely physical test.

Dustin Brooks: 13:15

That's it.

Sam Alaimo: 13:15

It's 5 minutes of treading water with 80 pound tanks

Dustin Brooks: 13:18

Yep.

Sam Alaimo: 13:19

With with fins and both hands above the water. If water goes above your wrist, you fail. So, I mean, you talk about what that 5 minutes was like.

Dustin Brooks: 13:27

So before I jumped in to Do Mine, one of the guys in our class is the fastest guy in our class. He played college soccer. He was lightning fast. In 4 mile time runs, he was always first. This guy gets in to do his tread, and he just makes up his mind.

Dustin Brooks: 13:44

I'm gonna do what I do on everything. I'm just gonna put out. It's gonna be fine. So I hear him. You can't face the other guys behind you.

Dustin Brooks: 13:52

You have to face away. And I hear them jump in. And then about 3 minutes in, the noises that I heard, like, things just went south for him really quickly, like an injured animal and a bunch of wild beasts just coming out. And then you just hear them all come around and he's gargling and drowning and like his, you know, he's just having the worst time. And then he goes out.

Dustin Brooks: 14:19

So like he, you know, inhales water goes out. They bring him out about on the pool deck. And we're, you know, like, what's going on? And look over and they, you know, he's he's out and they the hand of life, they smack him. He, like he comes back up, coughs up some water, and he was trying to put out so hard because that's how what he knew from running.

Dustin Brooks: 14:43

His legs just started kicking again like he like he's still trying to go, which is awesome because that's the quality of human that goes to that program. It's like he was out. The only thing that was stopping him from trying was because he was literally unconscious.

Sam Alaimo: 14:59

I'm still alive. Therefore, I'm gonna keep kicking the pipe.

Dustin Brooks: 15:02

Right. So then I'm like, alright. I'm going next. I didn't practice, didn't train anything, thought that I had it, and got humbled really quickly. I got in the water and, again, probably about the 3 minute mark, my legs locked up, brought my hands down, had people come around me, shove me in the water, slash me in the face.

Dustin Brooks: 15:26

Then after the 5 minutes, you have to swim to the other side of the pool and then swim back. And that whole travel, anytime that I would feel like a moment of comfort was about to happen, just pull you right back underwater. It was worse than, like, you know, the duration of hell week for me. I was like, man, I don't know if like, I don't know if that's actually a thing for me. Like, I don't know if if I can do that.

Dustin Brooks: 15:51

Luckily, there was some mold bags that just worked with us, and and then I came back and, you know, changed my technique, had some more information, and and did really well. But holy crap. Those are challenging environment.

Sam Alaimo: 16:03

So every day, you loved about Buds. And what's funny about Buds is every single day has failure built into it. You will fail something every single day. So it's almost like an incubator for entrepreneurship for the business world. Every single day is something's gonna go wrong.

Sam Alaimo: 16:18

Yeah. And, hopefully, it's something different at least so you don't get bored of the same failure again and again. So what was it about the failure that you you liked? How did you use it to iterate and make yourself better marginally at least every single day?

Dustin Brooks: 16:31

I I think the end goal is kind of the driver for, you know, for that program. And then, obviously, the lesson of life is that, you know, setting goals and knowing what you're working towards makes all that stuff a great transition. And it makes you be able to go to bed at the end of the day satisfied and full and wake up hungry. I think people come to those experiences on their own in a variety of different ways. I think that pipeline is beautiful in the sense that it really exposes that in a very condensed time frame, and it allows you to express it and then have the confidence.

Dustin Brooks: 17:11

I think the hard part and then, you know, from veterans that get out, especially, you know, soft operators is continuing to find it in a way that is fulfilling to them. You're surrounded by failure and, like, ultimate intensity, but there's always this greater goal that you're working towards. And, man, it's it's really a beautiful thing, like, the whole pipeline. I don't know that there's another option for me outside of entrepreneurship. The idea of finding a big problem, building a team around it, and then just starting to hack away at it and, like, realizing that you're really good at something.

Dustin Brooks: 17:48

I'm really good at something. This person's really good at something, and then defining that. It's a good thing. And there's challenges along the way, understanding those things, but it's ebbs and flows. Right?

Dustin Brooks: 18:00

And being able to take those those failures and turn them into successes.

Sam Alaimo: 18:03

So you endured the beautiful misery of Bud's seal selection. You make it to the seal teams. It's for you and I meet. Let's condense your time in the teams down to what was the the best aspect of the teams, the best moment of the teams, your favorite memory.

Dustin Brooks: 18:19

I'd section it out in 2 things. So in real time, in the moment, I'd say, again, the training. It's just so good, man. And then in reflection, I can appreciate the deployments. Right?

Dustin Brooks: 18:31

And and preparing for those moments and then getting to those moments and then being like, this is the kind of accumulation of all of that, what I just did, and then the application of it. And it it's humbling. It's exciting. It's terrifying. Those are kind of the 2 buckets I would put those 2 things.

Sam Alaimo: 18:54

How about on deployment? So, like, you and I did 2 deployments together. We saw the full spectrum of mission types. What would you say your favorite style was? Was it direct action, the guerrilla warfare?

Sam Alaimo: 19:04

Like, what what was it and why?

Dustin Brooks: 19:06

If I were to go through, like, boxes that I wanted to check, I would say that a lot of those boxes were checked. They weren't checked multiple times, but they were checked. On deployment, I think my favorite kind of things to engage with, My first one, we just did we did all flyaways, meaning I would go get on a helicopter. I would go get dropped off somewhere. I would sit in that place for 2 days.

Dustin Brooks: 19:30

I would get picked up by a helicopter and would come back. I remember my team lead at the time talking to me about mortgages. And, like, he gave me, like, a financial education on because he, you know, he's already married, had kids, bought houses, and, you know, had investments and stuff. And I I literally learned through, like, you know, what a mortgage credit was and how to take out a mortgage on a home on top of a mountain top in, in a third world country. So those moments were, like, really, really special and just, you know, kind of the the day to day nuances.

Dustin Brooks: 20:04

Life exists differently when you when you're in an environment like that. The ones that I didn't like the most were walking around in the middle of the night with me and 4 other guys for, you know, miles and miles. And knowing that in the environment I was walking around in, at any given point in time, I could lose a leg. That was very stressful. And and you and I both know guys that have fixed things that just knowing that that was a thing is was was tough.

Dustin Brooks: 20:38

It made it hard to, like, focus on the next step. So I think there's a lot of stuff that you've gotta kinda plow down just to get just to move forward in those environments, which is also, again, kind of a beautiful thing. Yeah. And reflection, thinking about that, you know, it's very fortunate that we're sitting here today without any potential injuries that could have taken place or were very near in taking place.

Sam Alaimo: 21:05

What was the point at which you knew you were not gonna make the military career and and you were thinking about getting out?

Dustin Brooks: 21:11

The adventure of a career aspect and and doing what I had done a couple of times did not seem appealing at all. Not to say that I wasn't fulfilled on the idea of, like, going to war and being a combatant and stuff. I I was, but I was also done. What's interesting in that community is a lot of times people consider it as quitting too. You know, you do 6 years and get out.

Dustin Brooks: 21:37

That's a real thing. Like, people are like, you didn't finish your career there. You quit. It took a while to, like, no. I I was done.

Dustin Brooks: 21:46

I just I didn't wanna do it anymore. I wanted to do a different adventure.

Sam Alaimo: 21:51

So, like, what's found out of the navy before between that and between 2018 when you founded Zero Eyes? What did you get into, and what was your transition like? The the psychological part, the emotional part, the experiential part.

Dustin Brooks: 22:04

Yeah. So when I got out, I did, I did have a bit of a plan. I wanted to finish college. I applied to some colleges while I was getting out of the military and they pretty much all came back to me and were like, a, your transcripts are terrible. And, b, you should take, like, like, a community college class and try to, like, show somebody some traction.

Dustin Brooks: 22:30

It sucked. I had plans. I wanted to go to the University of Colorado, and I wanted to move to Boulder. I wanted to get an education. Knowing that I need to do that.

Dustin Brooks: 22:39

I started, what's the next steps? How do I figure this out? And a former seal in Nashville, Tennessee, he got me work. And I was looking at taking a job with them, and I was trying to build a nonprofit to go high peak every state in the United States, which is high peaking if people aren't aware of it, is you go, you know, essentially stand at the top of every state and kind of bag that. I was looking in for an adventure and try to build some credentials in a space that I was interested in.

Dustin Brooks: 23:10

And then I

Sam Alaimo: 23:11

met my

Dustin Brooks: 23:11

wife, and I was like, you're the greatest adventure that I could take. That was over 10 years ago, and we're we're still together and have couple of kids. So good decision.

Sam Alaimo: 23:23

I wanna just ask one question before you move on to the business world, but you were an instructor for a little bit going back to BUDS in 3rd phase, which is the land warfare phase. Did you get to work a hell week?

Dustin Brooks: 23:33

I met my wife. I didn't know what I was gonna do next. I literally moved in with her with a truck and my dog and no job. So that's how my wife brought me in. I didn't know what I was gonna do.

Dustin Brooks: 23:46

So I started poking around. Okay. What jobs are guys like me getting? No college degree, former experienced in the military, and, you know, got kind of roped into the contracting world. I did some trips overseas doing protection on a few different things and, you know, made some money, generate some traction.

Dustin Brooks: 24:07

And I got word of a company that had contracting jobs for Buds instructors. And I was like, man, that seems like something that I could do that I could, you know, kind of build myself in the workforce, support that organization. And then the idea was to maybe even be able to grow up in that organization too, not just be on the contractor side, but get over into the business side. And I literally emailed the founder of that company probably every week for 6 months Alright. Or 8 months.

Sam Alaimo: 24:42

I didn't know that.

Dustin Brooks: 24:43

Yeah. And then I just moved to California. And then when I got to California, I sent him an email. I was like, hey. I moved to California.

Dustin Brooks: 24:50

I'm in San Diego. If you need anything, let me know. At that time, they had some people roll out, and he was like, hey. Let's meet. And we sat down.

Dustin Brooks: 25:01

We met. We talked, and he gave me a job. So, yeah, I took a took a 3rd phase, BUDS instructor position, and, it was awesome. Like, it was it was great, man. Like, some things that I I missed out on from being in the the teams, I got to, like, reengage, like, throw a grenade again.

Dustin Brooks: 25:22

I was like, I I never thought I was gonna do this again. And here I am getting a team of individuals like that, like the Bud students, and then giving them constructive direction and seeing what they can accomplish in such a short time frame, it was like, holy crap. And I did work a whole week. I worked a couple of hell weeks.

Sam Alaimo: 25:45

So before you do it, like, part of the theme of this podcast is is how do you iterate your way to success, whether it's in the military or in business entrepreneurship. And, like, there's a lot of wisdom in in the seal selection process. Then when you're going through it, it's just kinda pain. And you might have a vague idea, but you actually got to see it from the other side.

Dustin Brooks: 26:02

Sure.

Sam Alaimo: 26:02

So from that view, what did, like, budge and then zooming in specifically to Hell Week look like as an iterative process for the people going through it to get them to a certain goal, to get them to a certain toughness or a certain realization? How did that look like?

Dustin Brooks: 26:16

Lot of reflection of your own experience through it, and then being able to capture that, apply it to your experiences that you had in training in combat, and then, you know, mold that into them whenever you can. Because a lot of times, they're just checked out. When you get those moments where you can actually get eye contacts with them and make eye contact, it's okay. What am I gonna give this this individual to be able to, like, prepare them for the next step that they take? A lot of the times it was using the moment or the experience, whether it be like a surf passage that they were doing or whether it be them being on a log.

Dustin Brooks: 26:55

Just taking those moments of failure and be like, here's why you failed and why that failure is actually a success to you. I remember a student, young kid, probably just came out of high school, probably used to mouthing off everybody around him, didn't have, you know, a social structure in that sense or awareness. And he mouled off to one of the instructors in those environments, in those training environments. It's not about you. It's about the team.

Dustin Brooks: 27:21

So if you mess up, the team the team messes up, not you.

Sam Alaimo: 27:24

I think I remember this is such a good story about cause and effect, about repercussions and consequences. Yeah. Yeah. Talk about it this way.

Dustin Brooks: 27:32

So, you know, when you mess up in those environments, the team gets punished, not you, traditionally. In that phase of training, it's not about you as an individual performer anymore. It's about the team. That whole class ended up, for lack of a better way to put it, getting beat, I guess, for quite a bit of time while that student sit there and watched his class.

Sam Alaimo: 27:57

So he was not getting beaten. His entire class was getting beaten for his failure.

Dustin Brooks: 28:01

Exactly. Physically, you know, not not like beaten with, like, sticks, instead of like burpees or, like, whatever, sprints or or whatever. So, yeah, they were paying physically for his mistakes, which ultimately is worse. Right? Like, it then you walk around that within your class.

Dustin Brooks: 28:19

Mind you, I would like to fast forward. I saw this kid in the next stage of his training. Awesome. He was locked on. He was leading a group of of kids that were, you know, focused on their task and what they're doing.

Dustin Brooks: 28:32

So this is this isn't like a torture thing or whatever.

Sam Alaimo: 28:35

This is probably why he was able to achieve that state. Exactly. Spending his whole life mouthing off at everybody ever came across.

Dustin Brooks: 28:40

And you can't go into those moments softly. You have to learn those moments and they have to be ingrained in you or or it just never now when you get onto later phases of training, I think that kind of relaxes a little bit because the expectation is that, okay, like, we're all we all are professionals now. Let's build each other. Like, if you if you fall a little bit, that's all right, man. Let's go.

Dustin Brooks: 29:03

And so I remember sitting down with this class after that whole thing. It was like, we all knew that it was bad. Like, we all knew it was bad. I remember sitting down with those guys and being like, guys, what's the definition of a good gift? And, you know, nobody said anything.

Dustin Brooks: 29:18

I was like, something that you want, but you're not gonna get for yourself. And that's what we just gave you. And like, as messed up as that sounds, what we were able to do is create a base for them for when they actually get into a real situation, and they get into an environment that's terrible, that they can go back to and go, it's not as bad as that was. You know? Like, it it can be worse.

Dustin Brooks: 29:43

Like, I could be cold and sandy and wet and terrible and miserable and hate all my friends. It's not that bad. So then that gives you the space to feel safe. And when you're safe, you can make decisions, and you can take steps. And then that was the position that we tried to take as an instructor staff.

Sam Alaimo: 30:02

I love it. Let's fast forward to ZeroEyes. So did you have any sort of crisis of meaning during your transition? And if so, did that happen to coincide with the moment Mike, our current CEO of ZeroEyes, reached out to you with this idea of ZeroEyes of stopping mass shootings? Like, when did he reach out to you, and how did that impact you?

Dustin Brooks: 30:22

We kept in touch with Mike the whole time. So I guess there's about a 5 year period where, you know, once every 6 months or so we had touched base. I think Mike helped me with my resume a couple times. Mike was my LPO in, in buds, my, my leer in buds. And, Mike has a certain draw to him that I haven't seen in anybody else.

Dustin Brooks: 30:43

Mike truly walks around with something that's that's special. Like there's something about him. Mike went to actually have a conversation with the development of the technology and, like, what it could be. And he came back from that conversation. He was like, I think we can do this.

Dustin Brooks: 30:58

And when Mike said that, like, it could have been literally digging ditches for a living. Like, it was a no brainer for me. It was good friend move. It was a good career move. It was a good, like, exercise for adventure, and I needed that.

Dustin Brooks: 31:14

So when when Mike really started to put some gas on, I was like, okay. We're doing something. Like, something is happening. And I I remember the first time coming up to Philly to kind of workshop it. And then in reflection and knowing what I know about entrepreneurship now, it doesn't matter what the product is or what the software is or whatever.

Dustin Brooks: 31:36

It's the team. Do you have the team? Do you have the team to get the next steps? It's not always gonna be the right team through all phases, but, like, do you have a team to get started? To me, adventure, team, trust, like, these these things started to line up.

Dustin Brooks: 31:52

And I was like, alright. Like, let's go. All in.

Sam Alaimo: 31:56

In the middle of 0 Eyes, you actually got your MBA.

Dustin Brooks: 31:59

And And

Sam Alaimo: 31:59

I kinda wanna drill on on that one. Mhmm. Because, like, the advice from everybody here is don't waste your time. You did it, and your growth from that MBA was was literally tangible. Like, it was almost instantaneous.

Sam Alaimo: 32:09

Do you have anything you wanna share about the MBA, the quality of it, comparing the the business school versus what you learned in the real world, maybe how the 2 coincided with each other, run with it however you want.

Dustin Brooks: 32:20

We had not paid ourselves or taken a paycheck or, you know, done literally the sleeping founder's basement thing for 12 months, maybe more. And, we had just taken our 1st round of funding. The pandemic happened. I had my first kid, and I started Vanderbilt MBA program all at once. You and Mike and Rob were kinda inspirational in the sense that, you know, I'd I'd known you guys in the military.

Dustin Brooks: 32:55

I'd known what you guys could do, and we had worked together as peers and positions. And I remember starting Zero Eyes and being very under our position of of being able to contribute in in ways that, you know, business sense would be needed. But there was a language there that I just didn't know. So, you know, I had you guys to kinda look at that and be like, okay. You know, I've seen the transition with these guys too.

Dustin Brooks: 33:22

And whether you guys think that you need it or you didn't, there was just a a level of language that was there that didn't exist prior. I got the MBA, a, because, you know, we worked hard to be able to get sponsored, to be able to get a GI bill and to be able to go educate and then be able to provide and build companies and provide jobs and stuff. Like, that's something that I took very personally. Like, I I have this as a resource. Like, I I'm gonna do it.

Dustin Brooks: 33:48

I might as well have gone and learned, like, Spanish for 2 years and and then moved to South America. Right? Like, I went got an MBA, I learned that language. And when you can have a higher level conversation, you can go into deeper things. And when you can go into deeper things, you can really solve problems.

Dustin Brooks: 34:08

And I didn't want there to be a barrier there. And it allowed me to draw on different resources and make decisions. And something that would have taken me years to sit down and, like, figure out which book I need to read or, like, which podcast I need to listen to or whatever. It condensed it and gave me an outlet that it now I can work from.

Sam Alaimo: 34:29

And real quick, lightning around. 3 books and or 3 movies you think everybody should read and or watch?

Dustin Brooks: 34:36

We'll go movies first. So tombstone, fight clubs, one of my favorite movies, come back to the third one books. I just read green lights by Matthew McConaughey. I think the guy's super interesting and somebody that, like, just takes chances and moves forward. So he has a he has a really good book.

Dustin Brooks: 34:56

All the books that I've read recently are are literally about business and and venture capital and entrepreneurship. So, like

Sam Alaimo: 35:03

What's name 1?

Dustin Brooks: 35:04

Mastering the VC game or secrets of Sand Hill Road. Those are really fun just talking about, you know, cap tables and entrepreneurs from the venture capital perspective. I think they give a good insight on, like, hey. I know you feel this way, but, like, all companies in your stage feel this way. So, like, it'll be okay.

Dustin Brooks: 35:26

And then 3rd movie, Ninja Turtles 1.

Sam Alaimo: 35:31

Ninja Turtles 1. Alright. It's a good way to finish it.

Sam Alaimo: 35:36

That's it for this episode. If you wanna check out more from the podcast, head to zero eyes dot com slash Nobel, where you can see show notes, read more about our guests, and suggest guests or topics of your own. Until next time, stay in the fight. Don't ring the bell.